Real World Opinions on New Sonar Units

[big bend gyrene]

Ok... been a Lowrance user for a while but screen on my current 520 unit is crapping out. About 99% chance I'll be buying a GPS/Sonar combo but for the purpose of this thread more interested in focusing on sonar capabilities. Ability to record sonar logs also be a big + in my book as like exploring for new spots. For the sake of this thread, like to keep the new price tag under $1k if at all possible.

Went to look at new units and that left my head spinning a bit... units definitely have come a long way since my 520 purchase. So here are a few questions I have... love to hear board members opinions on them or ANYTHING else members think is of importance in getting a new unit.

1) I'm probably spending about 80% of time in midshore to offshore waters over hard bottom areas, rocky grounds and areas with artificial structure (towers, reefs, etc). Inshore I'm mainly using the sonar to know how shallow I am / though occasionally mark bomb craters as I pass over them and notice them. FOR OUR NECK OF THE WOODS, what technology AND / OR brand AND / OR unit would folks recommend considering my usage?

2) On the technology side, anybody feel really convicted on traditional broadband sonar marking vs DownVu vs SideVu? And asking again primarily relative to our midshore / offshore depths? Outside of the structure areas, anybody have a strong preference on technology when hunting swiss cheese / hard bottom / ledge areas?

3) On the brand note, with many now having competing DownVu & SideVu options, anybody have strong feelings on one brand versus others?

4) Last question, anybody have experience specifically with a Raymarine Dragonfly unit? Love it or hate it? Pros and cons? Don't ask because I'm leaning towards one but instead just because they stick out a bit on the design side from the general look of the other units.
ANY & ALL feedback MUCH appreciated!

[reelhandy]

I think one of the problems you are facing is that you are going to have to be satisfied with the options you choose. If you think Side View could possibly come in handy for finding new spots out there that could hold fish, and you elect to not get it, that might end up as a regret. Personally I think Side View and Down View have potential benefits for someone that fishes a lot in water 10' or deeper. For the flats and backwaters though they are pretty useless. Keep in mind that any unit out there that has the side and down features also have traditional screens to use if that suits you at a particular time when you are out there. The side view helps you see a wider area, and the down view helps you see more detail in the same area that traditional sonar would show. Screen size is also important. I think I'd give up side view over down view and screen size if I needed to give up one over the others, but I'd rather have all three.
I have a Humminbird, but the Lowrance and Garmins are as good if not better. Look close at what the package includes, and how much the upgraded charts are going to cost. I don't know anything about the Dragonfly, but I seem to recall someone here not being happy with the one they purchased. I forget why though.

[bman]

We need to run my boat out to a few of your spots so you can see what they look like on the down view.
Its really cool...

TC took me out in his bass boat with the side view and it was FANTASTIC. we could see downed trees and limbs coming out from the bank in 4-6foot of water.

I would tell you to stick with the company that you know.
I've had a hell of a time adjusting from Garmin to Lowrance.
I frequently wish I had a Garmin.

Maybe you should buy my Lowrance and I'll get a new Garmin

[Double Naught]

I've been a LOWRANCE user for a decade or so and wanted a side image unit. Recently online I found a Humminbird 899 ci HD with a 455 kHz side image transducer for $800 and change. It was the best I could afford and I am satisfied with the unit. The swing vote that made me go with the HB was that I didn't have to buy a separate module (at a high price) in order to enable (read 'support') the side imaging.
I have used it on Lake Talquin a few times now. Looking for structure on Talquin is like looking for a needle in a needle pile, but now I can see where the thickest tangle is even in shallow water of 6 feet and less.

Here's my list of lessons learned so far:
* The images I see on my screen are just as good as the advertisements. No disappointment at all.
* A bigger screen is always better. When zoomed out to see 150 ft. each direction, details get compressed so much I need reading glasses to watch the screen. I can't say this enough, no matter the brand, Go as big as your budget allows.
* The down imaging is good on my unit, but if you want the most detail, get a dedicated down image unit. IMO if you often fish deeper than 80 feet you would likely be better off with a quality down image instead of side imaging.
* Fish images are visible (barely), but the beauty in a side image is the definition of structure. Logs, stumps, rocks, reflect well and are very bright images (rocks especially).
* Schools of shad can not hide!!!
* I can switch to a 'standard' sonar view any time and view color fish arches as good as my LRNC ever did.
* A big plus for me is that it will record snapshots and sonar logs on a memory card for playback (gives corresponding GPS coord's) at your PC. My old LRNC's did this and I couldn't by any thing that wouldn't.

I don't know for sure if it can show swiss cheese bottom or not. There are a lot of snapshots posted online of bream beds or rocky ledges. If bottom depressions show up well, seems like holes should show up too.

[EddieJoe]

I had a Garmin 498 combo unit for 8 years, and it needed a new antenna, so this was an excuse to buy a new unit. I stuck with Garmin, but seems to me there are a lot of good choices.

I recently purchased a Garmin 547xs combo 5" unit, which has the capability to handle down vu, side vu, and CHIRP, but not all with the same transducer. If you wanted all of them you would have to purchase I believe at least two transducers.
I went with the TM150 CHIRP ducer, which works very well. For a discussion of CHIRP you can google it, but for me it was the technology that could see fish and bottom structure well. I also bought the Garmin G2 chip for enhanced mapping, which is fantastic. The chip was on special when I bought the unit.

Bigger is definitely better, but I have limited console real estate, and I don't like flush mounts for units on my boat, as they have to be too low. So I stuck with the same size I had before in a bracket mount. I also kept a traditional button interface, because I have used a touch screen on a small boat and while it works great the smudges are a problem and in any kind of chop it is easy to goof up your finger commands. I am very pleased with the unit, which cost me about a grand out the door, including the transducer.

I recommend playing with them at West Marine, but buying online. Thats what I did.

Oh, one bit of experience: the Garmin manual is almost useless, its kind of like buying a smart phone, the documentation is limited. You almost have to learn by fiddling, but the Garmin interface is about as intuitive as you can find.

EJ

[silverking]

I wrote an overview on the latest sonar technology for the current issue of Outdoor Life. Don't think it's on-line yet, but the magazine is still on the newsstands.

Haven't personally used any of the new sonar technology but will be purchasing the Garmin 44dv for the new skiff. Like Eddie Joe, I will have a very small mounting area and will go with the bracket mount for the down view combo.

I used a couple of Lowrance combo units on the Bayshore but finally switched after multiple antenna problems. Went with the Garmin 740s combo touchscreen and have been happy with that choice. It is very intuitive and I didn't have any problems with the touch screen. All a matter of personal preference. Those units were flush-mounted into the adjustable electronics pod (with teak panel backing ), so visibility was not a problem. I did have to replace the transducer recently and that was an unexpected and premature expense. It wasn't built by Garmin though. I will second EJ's remarks about Garmin's manual. You have to download it from the site and it's not as easy to follow as the actual unit. Hands-on experimentation is the best way to learn the various functions.

I've tested multiple boats with Raymarine products and the early generation were not impressive. Too many annoying glitches. Company ownership has changed recently, however, and the latest products work great from limited use. But no experience with the particular unit you mentioned, BBG. In all fairness, Lowrance has stepped up its game lately too.

Marine electronics are kind of like outboards and trucks. Each manufacturer has their own following and all have good selling points. The main difference comes down to desired features and familiarity with the brands.

[zload]

I'm partial to Garmin because that's what I've used over the years and it seems to me that most people like them, personally they are intuitive to use and the manual is more for the initial configuration(keel offset/fuel mgt etc.) as compared to being needed for normal use. If I were buying today I would look at the Garmin 741xs for a couple of reasons CHIRP capable, Downvu/SideVu capable, touchscreen and finally wireless compatibility to iPads etc. with the Garmin Apps and maps so that you can transfer waypoints etc. without a PC.

Garmin was sort of dissed in the past for their sonar but the CHIRP stuff should take care of that but then again that was more likely people who were fishing in 500' + of water in the first place, I've never had a problem spotting fish and structure at the near shore reefs in 100' of water with my 740s and a basic transom mount transducer. The touch screen is the bomb in my opinion and having it be NMEA 2000 compatible so I can see all the engine data including fuel management stuff along with the Sirius/XM weather module (nice to dodge or run from the T'storms while listening to the 70s channel ) and radar if you want it are just icing on the cake.

The very detailed G2 coastal chart will come standard with the unit and can be transferred over to a PC for use with Homeport at no cost and for the Big Bend area I don't see the point of the Vision card upgrade.

I will also say that the 7" screen is much easier on my 50+ year old eyes compared to the 4" - 5" models

I'm sure the other brands are good and have similar features but if I was replacing my 740s today it would be with a 741xs. I'm not sure about sonar mapping but I know you can store screen shots etc. They are around the $1000 range without transducer and you can spend a ton on the various transducers depending on what capabilities you want or $80 on the temp/speed/depth plastic transom mount which is what I use.

Keep us posted on the research and decision...

[EddieJoe]

The 740xs has been discontinued but you might find one in stock online. If so, they are a deal.

Edit: it's the 741xs that is discontinued. Stocks are limited to those on hand.

[silverking]

Yes, forgot to add that my unit has now been replaced by the 741. I have the bronze thru-hull single frequency transducer and it paints an excellent picture even at wide open throttle. I had it installed though. Just couldn't bring myself to drill a hole in the boat.

BBG, if you decide to go with a 740s, I'll sell you mine for $36,500 and throw in the boat, engine and trailer for free.

[Redbelly]

I am also deciding on which unit.
From what I have learned from the you tube videos explaining them all, I am most likely going with the HB899.

I want SI first, DI 2nd, and traditional sonar 3rd. I think that the 899 has it all, with a 7" screen plus GPS and the mapping.
Its at the top of my spending allowance

I suggest spending time watching the you tube videos.

[silverking]

Got a West Marine flyer in the mail yesterday. Big sale on electronics starting June 25-28. Garmin GPSMap 741XS is $999.99. EchoMap 74dv is $799. Lowrance, Raymarine and Simrad units also on sale.

Lowrance Elite 7 & 9 CHIRP Nav+ Chartplotter come with up to $300 rebate, starting at $769.99.

Handheld Garmins with $50 -$100 off.

[big bend gyrene]

Still juggling homework on units between work (at office and home), but for everyone who has taken the time to respond VERY much appreciated.

[zload]

Yes, forgot to add that my unit has now been replaced by the 741. I have the bronze thru-hull single frequency transducer and it paints an excellent picture even at wide open throttle. I had it installed though. Just couldn't bring myself to drill a hole in the boat.

BBG, if you decide to go with a 740s, I'll sell you mine for $36,500 and throw in the boat, engine and trailer for free.

I like the way you think SK As far as I know the 741xs is the latest model in the 700 series as it is still showing on Garmin's main chart plotter page but the prices have dropped to below $1000 online. They started out around $1500 even going back to when they introduced the 740s so anything below $1000 is an excellent deal. I've got my plastic transom transducer working well up to about 40 mph and it holds depth past that so have not bit the bullet on the bronze thru hull but that really is the way to go for a new install...

[hambric85]

I just put a lowrance hds9 gen 3 on my glasstream, I love it! I'm pretty sure the 7" is around 1300. If you like the idea of making your own maps from your scans, its the way to go! Garmin makes echomap models that work great, but echomap models are not nmea capable.

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

[Double Naught]

Gyrene,
I took another trip to Talquin and recorded some sonar logs. This snapshot shows the side image in 12 feet of water. You can see to bait balls under the boat and on both sides of the boat. This is a with 455Khz transducer. The distortion is where I made a course adjustment. HumViewer is the free software that makes the playback work and is how I saved these images on the PC.

Shad are everywhere

The GPS #'s are real, not much to hide on Talquin, the lake looks like this pretty much all over.

Here is another cool view. That's the down imaging on the left. I've read he down image would be crisper on a dedicated down imaging unit and I tend to agree, it's good but not great. The side imaging is the best feature. Check out that clean flat cut on the tree stump. Too cool!
One day, when I get tired of riding and looking, maybe I can do some fishing too

Trees, bait, table top rock

Here's another cool one of shad at the Iron Curtain. Looks like there were predators chasing them.

Iron Curtain on 5-17-15

Like I said before, I'm satisfied with my unit. It would be better with a larger screen than the HB 899. There is much more detail than I could discern on the water. It is a lot better at home on my PC screen though. The 1199 ci would be my favorite till something bigger comes along.

This is on my small freshwater boat right now. I'm anxious to get another ducer and mount for the bay boat. DB Reef will be fun in the fall with all the cubes around.