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JUST GOT BACK FROM THE LOCAL HEALTH CLINIC HERE IN CAIRO. THE PERSON THAT I CARRIED THERE, ME, AND 14 GUATS AND MEXICANOS WERE THERE TO GET FREE MEDICAL TREATMENT, JUST LIKE THE PERSON I CARRIED DOWN THERE. THE MAIN DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE MEX'S & GUATS COMPARED TO THE PERSON I CARRIED DOWN THERE IS THE FACT THAT SHE PAID INTO THE SYSTEM FOR OVER 50 YEARS AND DESERVED TO BE TREATED WHERE AS THE MEX'S AND GUATS I DOUBT VERY SERIOUSLY EVER PAID 1 DIME INTO THE SYSTEM AND THEY ARE DRAWING OUT 14 TIMES MORE THAN THE 1 PERSON I CARRIED THERE. THIS IS JUST WRONG, IF YOU HAVE NOT PAID INTO THE SYSTEM YOU SHOULD NOT GET ANYTHING OUT OF THE SYSTEM.
PA THE OLD MAN

Whether or not illegal immigrants are getting free health care under the current law is not the issue. The issue is the current health care reform bill, which plainly states that no illegal immigrants are to benefit from it. Calling Obama a liar like that was childish and irresponsible. Obama didn't create the laws that allow illegal immigrants to recieve free health care from the ER or Health Departments.

The Rebulicans are just angry that their "death panel" myth has been debunked and are looking for another issue to compromise the health care bill.

People, please don't just believe whatever you hear on FOX News or Rush Limbaugh. Read the bill. I admit that I haven't read the whole thing, but I did read the part denying benefits to illegal immigrants. It appears to me that Joe Wilson hasn't read the bill for himself.

The issue is still how are you going to enforce denying illegals healthcare, when it is iilegal to turn them away?

Reel Cowboy wrote:The issue is still how are you going to enforce denying illegals healthcare, when it is iilegal to turn them away?

It's not about denying them health care, it's about denying them the benefits of a government funded health care insurance. Without insurance, they will still be forced to go to the ER or to the Health Department where they will recieve "less than ideal" health care. Legal residents will have insurance, so they can afford to go to private clinics and recieve better health care (hopefully).

I agree with you that the proposed bill does nothing to stop what is already going on (free care at ER's and Health Departments for illegals), but I don't see how it's going to benefit illegals any more.

The facts is that the proposed plan does nothing to benefit illegal aliens, it just doesn't take away what they already have.

By the way, I have insurance now that I pay good money for. I don't think that this plan will benefit me at all, since I plan to stay with my current insurance. But I know people who have worked hard their entire lives who are not old enough to qualify for MediCare, and are too poor to buy insurance. I'm for the Health Care Reform because I believe that they should have access to the same high quality health care I do.

just my $0.02

CrispyFishin wrote:Joe Wilson = Right Wing wack job

...he's just like the other righty wack jobs that pulled their kids out of school when the prez wanted to talk to them, the same ones that told me that my kids were going to get brainwashed into communism if I let them go to school that day (i'm still waiting for someone to point out the socialist propoganda within the speech, maybe it was little subliminal messages?)

Common sense Americans should beware of extremist loonies, 'cause if they belong to your politcal party, they're gonna wreck your credibility (again).

Stating an opinion now makes you a "right wing wack job"?
People who don't want their children exposed to the pandering of a politician when they aren't present are "righty wack jobs"?

Once again Crispy has elegantly and with class shown what a clever little liberal he is. Rather than address how or why he doesn't agree he simply reverts to classifying anyone who doesn't agree with him and his political sensibilities as "extremist loonies". Much the same as we have seen from Pelosi, Napolitano, and other democrats who are afraid to face resistance. I hear a view from a Democrat and I state "I think you're wrong because...". Crispy hears the view of a Republican and states "you're a right wing wack job". Open argument and debate is one of the founding principles of this country. But what do I know....I'll just go home to my small town and bitterly cling to my guns and religion being the right wing wack job that I am.

Reel Cowboy wrote:The issue is still how are you going to enforce denying illegals healthcare, when it is iilegal to turn them away?

Maybe Im wrong but why are we wanting to turn away sick people who cant afford health care? Yes they may be illegals but the are people. I pay taxes and would rather have my money spent on people here in america that have problems instead of spending millions on people in iraq that dont want it and hate us. Hey here is a thought if you dont want to pay for their health care stop hiring them, they will go home.
The reason he sould appologize is because not only is he wrong but he showed no class. In eight years you never heard any Democrats screeming "Coke Junky" during any of Bush's addresses and that would have been true. My .02

"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."
Thomas Jefferson

bull68dawg wrote:

Reel Cowboy wrote:The issue is still how are you going to enforce denying illegals healthcare, when it is iilegal to turn them away?

Maybe Im wrong but why are we wanting to turn away sick people who cant afford health care? Yes they may be illegals but the are people. I pay taxes and would rather have my money spent on people here in america that have problems instead of spending millions on people in iraq that dont want it and hate us. Hey here is a thought if you dont want to pay for their health care stop hiring them, they will go home.
The reason he sould appologize is because not only is he wrong but he showed no class. In eight years you never heard any Democrats screeming "Coke Junky" during any of Bush's addresses and that would have been true. My .02

I think every one sees that illegal aliens are people but the key work there is “illegal”. I have no problem if some one comes here legally and works, pays taxes, and is a benefit to America. I don’t see how people justify some one stealing from your tax dollars. If some one stole something from your home you would be upset. What is the difference? I also pay taxes, like most of America, and you have the right to your opinion. I to would rather the money be spent here in the states, but regrettably in my opinion the people in Iraq and other nations around the globe as a hole are more thankful for the things we do for them than the people here are. The two years I spent over seas 99% of the people there were grateful that we were there. The other 1% cost me two friends and some hearing in my left ear. Don’t believe every thing you hear on the news or some ones blog. Don’t just take my word for it either take a trip and see it first hand.

yakker wrote:

because I believe that they should have access to the same high quality health care I do

If you have any idea that high quality and a national plan have anything in common.. you have been dooped!

I think every one sees that illegal aliens are people but the key work there is “illegal”. I have no problem if some one comes here legally and works, pays taxes, and is a benefit to America. I don’t see how people justify some one stealing from your tax dollars. If some one stole something from your home you would be upset. What is the difference? I also pay taxes, like most of America, and you have the right to your opinion. I to would rather the money be spent here in the states, but regrettably in my opinion the people in Iraq and other nations around the globe as a hole are more thankful for the things we do for them than the people here are. The two years I spent over seas 99% of the people there were grateful that we were there. The other 1% cost me two friends and some hearing in my left ear. Don’t believe every thing you hear on the news or some ones blog. Don’t just take my word for it either take a trip and see it first hand.[/quote]



I believe nothing I see in the news. But I do see my cousin and instead of 2 arms he now has one because of the same 99% of the grateful people in Iraq. He was wounded 6-8-06 by a 13 year old boy which he was building a school for. So i dont need to take a trip to see how we are wasting my tax dollars, I just have to look across the table at Thanksgiving and Christmas. Thx

This is not about the illegals or the poor people. It is about our elected government telling us what is best for us. Not what we want and can afford for us. They stopped the town hall meetings because they did not want to hear what was being said,
Our 540 odd elected officials are out for what is best for them,not what is best for the remaining 300 million citizens.

I find it hilarious that ALL of the politicians that imposed the ridiculous rules upon the states and insurance companies want to control them all now, which is 1/6 of the US economy. That would give a government Czar over health care more power than the president.

Why not change the rules so that I can buy insurance from any insurance company in any state. I work for the fifth largest employer in the world and can't carry over the insurance I had in Virginia to the state of Florida even though I moved here with the same employer. My insurance was cheaper and better in Virginia.

Relax HIPPA regulations so my medical records are available electronically at every medical facility I go to. i would have to pay $250 to get copies of my medical records from my Virginia doctor. And even though I will never go back to that doctor, they can't give them to me.

And change the rules ( that insurance lobbyist colluded with politicians on) preventing insurance companies from dropping medical liability patients.
I also support Tort reform preventing extravagant lawsuits. Maybe put a cap on the amount a hospital or doctor has to pay when a family sues after their family member dies during surgery.

Fine plan make problems then campaign to fix them.
Oldest scam in the world and we fall to every party that uses it to get elected.

I think both party's are culpable in this fiasco.

I believe the bottom line is not Rep. or Dem. Its Government. If Government starts running health care what makes anyone (Rep. or Dem.) believe it will be better. Lets see, can anyone here tell me what the government has ran efficiently (OTHER THEN THE MILITARY OF COURSE ) and has not become a complete flop. Let’s see ill try first..:

1- Post office.. oops wait, the president himself even said that wasn’t working.. Ill try again,
2- Fanny and Freddy.. whoops.. not their either uh... lets see
3- Social Security.. Oh yeah.. we can all laugh at that one uh... Ha... Ill try once more.. ummmmmm
4-Cash For Clunkers... Wait they screwed that one up in less than a week.. Damn.. any one else want to try...??????

Flanders wrote:I believe the bottom line is not Rep. or Dem. Its Government. If Government starts running health care what makes anyone (Rep. or Dem.) believe it will be better. Lets see, can anyone here tell me what the government has ran efficiently (OTHER THEN THE MILITARY OF COURSE ) and has not become a complete flop. Let’s see ill try first..:

1- Post office.. oops wait, the president himself even said that wasn’t working.. Ill try again,
2- Fanny and Freddy.. whoops.. not their either uh... lets see
3- Social Security.. Oh yeah.. we can all laugh at that one uh... Ha... Ill try once more.. ummmmmm
4-Cash For Clunkers... Wait they screwed that one up in less than a week.. Damn.. any one else want to try...??????

Well, lets see, they confiscated the Mustang Ranch in Nevada, and tried to run it and failed...Now if you can't run a whorehouse than sells liquor and make a go of it, you are just a FAIL.

Linky Dinky

Dubble

Don't want to offend anyone by calling out names, so I won't but will bet I can end this debate pretty quick like.

I'll put my money where my mouth is on this one. If government run health care is passed, I'll bet any one supporting it on this post a Ulysses S. Grant that it won't prove itself deficit neutral in 20 years, as the President promises it will.

Be curious to see if I get a single taker. If not than I would like to hear why folks supporting it are for it when it almost certainly will further increase our tax burden. Had a friend last night that made a brilliant comment. He said he didn't think liberals were evil or that many had bad intentions. His words were too wise, in my humble opinion, not to share...

Liberals in general are a group that like to feel they are doing "good". They believe in simple solutions and ignore the details in order to keep things, well, feeling "good". What they often are not are realists, nor do they like to acknowledge the complex concept of "The Law of Unintended Consequences". And that is what is getting us in trouble this very moment. The liberal guy says, "Hey, this will be a good thing, so let's do it, 'cause we like good things!" The conservative guy says, "But it will almost certainly cause 10 bad things in the process!?" The liberal says, "You are against a good thing!!! HEY everybody, this guy hates good things!" This simplistic thinking as relates to a complex issue is quite scary to me. As for the actual "liberal" politicians themselves, unbeknown to their followers they see it as power, pure and simple. Make the medical system out to be evil, let everyone have a focal point for their problems, then rush in with a solution that sounds "good". BAM, they're heroes.

Anybody wishes to place the friendly wager, just holla back... not often I get to bet on sure things