And since you left it alone, I will also from the other viewAnd then there are the commercial guys, but I'll leave that issue alone.
What do you think is wrong....
Moderators: bman, Chalk, Tom Keels
Just coming from the upper Tx coast, and having not yet fished in Fla, I can't offer much comparative analysis. But as to some of the theories advanced in this thread:
pollution? no way. As was mentioned earlier, the Tx and La. coasts host one of the largest petrochemical centers anywhere, both off and onshore drilling - and refineries are almost always located on coasts for shipping purposes (but admittedly, bay and offshore drilling platforms are great places to fish).
pressure - I haven't seen NW Fla. pressure yet, but I can't believe that it matches the upper Tx coast, which must support sportsmen from Houston, the 4th largest city in the country. Austin and San Antonio, both over a milion pop, also contribute.
Trout fishing in Tx. is all about visibility; the longshore current carries sediments in from the Miss. River, and without a light SE breeze, the water is usually too off-color to catch sight-feeding trout. But the trout are there, because with the Miss. River sediments come nutrients that fertilize phytoplankton growth - much of the poor viz in Tx and La is due to rich phytoplankton concentration, not suspended sediments. In terms of biological productivity TX and LA fisheries probably exceed those here. So these areas naturally support a large trout fishery, and when the water clears, trout are slayed by the fisherpeople.
By the way, Tx trout limits are: no closed season, 15" min/no max, 10 per day/20 possession. Reds are 20-28" slot, 3 per day, oversized tags available upon request. But it ain't heaven - because of visibility, few trout are caught most days of the year. On those special "green-water, chamber of commerce days" (or series of days), limits are routine.
My .02 - at least the water's clear here...AND, inshore grouper, cobia, kings are unheard of in Tx - 20-50 miles out except for when an occasional bluewater current drifts in. Color change into blue water can be 60 miles out or further. And that's what I think I'm gonna like about Fla...
pollution? no way. As was mentioned earlier, the Tx and La. coasts host one of the largest petrochemical centers anywhere, both off and onshore drilling - and refineries are almost always located on coasts for shipping purposes (but admittedly, bay and offshore drilling platforms are great places to fish).
pressure - I haven't seen NW Fla. pressure yet, but I can't believe that it matches the upper Tx coast, which must support sportsmen from Houston, the 4th largest city in the country. Austin and San Antonio, both over a milion pop, also contribute.
Trout fishing in Tx. is all about visibility; the longshore current carries sediments in from the Miss. River, and without a light SE breeze, the water is usually too off-color to catch sight-feeding trout. But the trout are there, because with the Miss. River sediments come nutrients that fertilize phytoplankton growth - much of the poor viz in Tx and La is due to rich phytoplankton concentration, not suspended sediments. In terms of biological productivity TX and LA fisheries probably exceed those here. So these areas naturally support a large trout fishery, and when the water clears, trout are slayed by the fisherpeople.
By the way, Tx trout limits are: no closed season, 15" min/no max, 10 per day/20 possession. Reds are 20-28" slot, 3 per day, oversized tags available upon request. But it ain't heaven - because of visibility, few trout are caught most days of the year. On those special "green-water, chamber of commerce days" (or series of days), limits are routine.
My .02 - at least the water's clear here...AND, inshore grouper, cobia, kings are unheard of in Tx - 20-50 miles out except for when an occasional bluewater current drifts in. Color change into blue water can be 60 miles out or further. And that's what I think I'm gonna like about Fla...
oh yeah, about seagrasses in TX and La, as Chalk mentioned - too much turbidity these days. Historically they existed but now are pretty rare, especially turtle grass. The nurseries are the salt marshes.
Lower Tx coast has more grasses, it's further from the Miss. River and has generally a sandier substrate (upper TX and LA has so much clay substrate, another reason for turbidity, especially when it's disturbed)..
Lower Tx coast has more grasses, it's further from the Miss. River and has generally a sandier substrate (upper TX and LA has so much clay substrate, another reason for turbidity, especially when it's disturbed)..
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Fisherman989
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My 2c worth....I have been fishing the Gulf coast from Panacea to Dead Man's Bay (Steinhatchee) since the early 70's....almonst 35 years. In the early days Aucilla River landing would see upwards of 75-90 boats on the weekend during Oct-Nov-Dec. During the week, now, there will be maybe 10-12 boats ...and on the weekend, maybe30-40.There was no numbers limit on trout or red fish then....only a 12 in. minimum. There was no where to park..except back down the dirt road. When you could finally put in....on good days everyone caught upwards of 25-70 trout.Some got over 100. The netters were in the river...nets strung out sometime above the demarkation line (prohibited zone). Everyone caught fish. Always...sometime during the day a circle would form below the rockpile and the island....and bull reds would be found breaking lines and recking havoc with the fishermen. Some were caught...6-8-10 pounders...a lot got away. The term "coolerfull" was coined during this time. You didn't tell others how many you caught...only how many coolerfull's you had. The same story was true for Econfina, Fenholloway, and Dead Man's Bay. I have seen....and participated in catching litterally thousands of trout at Steinhatchee. The catches in those days were indescribable....and there was twice as many people fishing the rivers then as now. Steinhatchee says the trout have not come into their river in good numbers in over 10 years. They have not come into Aucilla or Econfina either in the past 3 years. Fishing on the flats was just as good as the rivers.
Limits were instituted ...and on the last day of unlimited catches we caught 110 trout in my boat at Aucilla...above the landing.The game warden was there....checked me out...congratulated me on the good catch...said it was tipical.
When the "season" started the next spring...the limit was 10 trout per person. It was 3 years before I caught the limit. I said I was going to quit. I didn't. The limit was lowered to 7 a few years later. It was real hard to catch 7 each. The limit stayed fixed at 7 for a few years....and was finally lowered to the current 5 for our area...and a closed season was established.
Except for a few bigger trout being available....fishing has been very iffy and mostly poor since the limits were imposed.
I have no idea what-so-ever why this is true.
I have the book "In Search of the Aucilla" by R.C. Balfour from Thomasville, Ga. He says the boat traffic in these rivers caused the fishing downturn. I just don't know the answer to this great mystery.
Whatever Texas and Louisana are doing...we ought to implement the same thing.
Limits were instituted ...and on the last day of unlimited catches we caught 110 trout in my boat at Aucilla...above the landing.The game warden was there....checked me out...congratulated me on the good catch...said it was tipical.
When the "season" started the next spring...the limit was 10 trout per person. It was 3 years before I caught the limit. I said I was going to quit. I didn't. The limit was lowered to 7 a few years later. It was real hard to catch 7 each. The limit stayed fixed at 7 for a few years....and was finally lowered to the current 5 for our area...and a closed season was established.
Except for a few bigger trout being available....fishing has been very iffy and mostly poor since the limits were imposed.
I have no idea what-so-ever why this is true.
I have the book "In Search of the Aucilla" by R.C. Balfour from Thomasville, Ga. He says the boat traffic in these rivers caused the fishing downturn. I just don't know the answer to this great mystery.
Whatever Texas and Louisana are doing...we ought to implement the same thing.
Last edited by Fisherman989 on March 3rd, 2005, 8:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
Fish 989:Fisherman989 wrote:My 2c worth....I have been fishing the Gulf coast from Panacea to Dead Man's Bay (Steinhatchee) since the early 70's....almonst 45 years. In the early days Aucilla River landing would see upwards of 75-90 boats on the weekend during Oct-Nov-Dec. During the week, now, there will be maybe 10-12 boats ...and on the weekend, maybe30-40.There was no numbers limit on trout or red fish then....only a 12 in. minimum. There was no where to park..except back down the dirt road. When you could finally put in....on good days everyone caught upwards of 25-70 trout.Some got over 100. The netters were in the river...nets strung out sometime above the demarkation line (prohibited zone). Everyone caught fish. Always...sometime during the day a circle would form below the rockpile and the island....and bull reds would be found breaking lines and recking havoc with the fishermen. Some were caught...6-8-10 pounders...a lot got away. The term "coolerfull" was coined during this time. You didn't tell others how many you caught...only how many coolerfull's you had. The same story was true for Econfina, Fenholloway, and Dead Man's Bay. I have seen....and participated in catching litterally thousands of trout at Steinhatchee. The catches in those days were indescribable....and there was twice as many people fishing the rivers then as now. Steinhatchee says the trout have not come into their river in good numbers in over 10 years. They have not come into Aucilla or Econfina either in the past 3 years. Fishing on the flats was just as good as the rivers.
Limits were instituted ...and on the last day of unlimited catches we caught 110 trout in my boat at Aucilla...above the landing.The game warden was there....checked me out...congratulated me on the good catch...said it was tipical.
When the "season" started the next spring...the limit was 10 trout per person. It was 3 years before I caught the limit. I said I was going to quit. I didn't. The limit was lowered to 7 a few years later. It was real hard to catch 7 each. The limit stayed fixed at 7 for a few years....and was finally lowered to the current 5 for our area...and a closed season was established.
Except for a few bigger trout being available....fishing has been very iffy and mostly poor since the limits were imposed.
I have no idea what-so-ever why this is true.
I have the book "In Search of the Aucilla" by R.C. Balfour from Thomasville, Ga. He says the boat traffic in these rivers caused the fishing downturn. I just don't know the answer to this great mystery.
Whatever Texas and Louisana are doing...we ought to implement the same thing.
I also began to fish the Big Bend a while back for trout when I came here for school in 1971, which is 34 years ago, now (I think your math is a little off
). We all caught a bunch then, and the 12" size limit made it easy to fill the cooler. However, we must have fished a different river, because when I used to fish out of the Econfina 30 years ago there were only a few boats going out, even on Saturday during the Spring. Now, you can hardly get a boat in on a nice weekend. Lots more anglers, I believe.Spotted Sea Trout are what some call a "weed" fish, in that they grow quickly and can be sexually reproductive within their first year. As such, they can recover quickly from overfishing, and don't have the problems that red drum do with a more complicated life history, a longer period until reproductive age, and inshore/offshore migrations.
There is virtually no question that the reduction in Trout we have seen (with some rebound lately) over the last 10-15 years is simply pressure on the fishery. When I was involved in such matters I reviewed the data, and sea trout were significantly overfished for a number of years before the old Marine Fisheries Commission had the nerve to reduce the catch by more stringent regulations. Trout are probably still somewhat overfished, and I wouldn't be surprized to see them further regulated in the future. Again, our habitat produces lots of trout, but our fishermen take them quickly. Regulating the fishery didn't cause the fishery to decrease. Without the regulations trout populations might have collapsed.
And, since trout don't range far during their lifetimes, they can be locally "fished out" by hard charging anglers hitting them in the same area. This happens frequently in the Aucilla during the winter when the boys come down and clog the river with boats, and when the tournaments come down and hit them hard. You can really tell the difference before and after, and eventually this will have to be better managed to protect the resource.
EJ
There are plenty of people fishing in MS, and LA. I saw a show on TV the other day and it said there is approx. 17 million trout caught in LA a year. There is just so many bayous and estuaries they can get in. I remember growing up in Mississippi and catching 2, 150 quart ice chests full of trout and it still can be done. Look at a map of LA. There's nothing but marsh down there. We used to shrimp the LA marshs and there is so much bait (shrimp) down there. The chandeller (sp) islands produce great numbers of trout and reds.
Not so fast, my friend!
As is always the case, I know the answer to this question.
The reason, comparing La. to Fla., is that La. has a huge, depth of coastal marsh (swamp) compared to this area of Fla. Like the St. Marks to way down towards Cedar Key, the marsh is very, thin, and it's this area that contains the, bio-mass, so vital to pumping out the vittles that trout and red fish consume and grow rapidly in size and numbers.
True, the Mighty Mississip does pump out a lot of nutrients, too, as well as pollution, but the later, when the river water shoots way out in the Gulf, the pollution gets broken down, mostly, and then the mix, then mostly nutrients, finds its way by tidal action into those vast swamps and nourishes all them critters that the trout and redfish munch on. Tuna also come in to the lump during the winter time to munch on the hoards of baitfish that are attracted to the Mississippi River fed, soup of microorganisms.
It's either the above, or that, are all them Gawga illegals that keep the water so stirred up with all them jon boats, that makes the water so stained, the trout and redfish can't see good enough to grab a grub!
As is always the case, I know the answer to this question.
The reason, comparing La. to Fla., is that La. has a huge, depth of coastal marsh (swamp) compared to this area of Fla. Like the St. Marks to way down towards Cedar Key, the marsh is very, thin, and it's this area that contains the, bio-mass, so vital to pumping out the vittles that trout and red fish consume and grow rapidly in size and numbers.
True, the Mighty Mississip does pump out a lot of nutrients, too, as well as pollution, but the later, when the river water shoots way out in the Gulf, the pollution gets broken down, mostly, and then the mix, then mostly nutrients, finds its way by tidal action into those vast swamps and nourishes all them critters that the trout and redfish munch on. Tuna also come in to the lump during the winter time to munch on the hoards of baitfish that are attracted to the Mississippi River fed, soup of microorganisms.
It's either the above, or that, are all them Gawga illegals that keep the water so stirred up with all them jon boats, that makes the water so stained, the trout and redfish can't see good enough to grab a grub!
In a land called, Perfect, sea grits grows on the beach dunes in patches next to those of sea oats!
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dstockwell
- Posts: 4214
- Joined: March 5th, 2002, 8:00 pm
- Location: Valdosta, GA
From past experience outa Keaton, we seemed to catch far more Trout North of Adams / Deckle beach than around the Big Grass Island area. Is it because the water is too clear South vs North, or because we always decided to head toward the Spring Warrior area. Also we had no trolling motor and South is shallower alot further from land than North is. Who knows we seemed to have better luck in water that was not gin clear.
That's cause one look at you and they all RUN 
But seriously, you have to use different bait and/or presentation of bait with differing water clarity
But seriously, you have to use different bait and/or presentation of bait with differing water clarity “Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you are a mile away from them and you have their shoes.”
Not enough river, do do, around heah!
Only river that drains from fairly far inland is dammed up (Apalachacola up at Chattahooooocheeeee)!
Other rivers are mostly, spring fed (mostly clear spring water).
Inland areas where spring fed rivers drain, Fla. rivers 'round heah flow through sandy soil overlying limestone and don't pickup much, do do.
We are, do do, challenged and overrun by them Crackers wit dem jon boats. a stirring up what little do do we got and blinding the trout and redfish.
Outlawing jon boats would help a lot, but the big problem is -- more do do is needed, and if there was a way to syphone it off of this forum, we could fill up buckets, barrels and wheel borrows with inshore species, like they do in Lost Banana!
Texas also got lots of do do from all them bulls they raises o'er there and even more from their BS about ever thang being bigger o'er 'air!
Only river that drains from fairly far inland is dammed up (Apalachacola up at Chattahooooocheeeee)!
Other rivers are mostly, spring fed (mostly clear spring water).
Inland areas where spring fed rivers drain, Fla. rivers 'round heah flow through sandy soil overlying limestone and don't pickup much, do do.
We are, do do, challenged and overrun by them Crackers wit dem jon boats. a stirring up what little do do we got and blinding the trout and redfish.
Outlawing jon boats would help a lot, but the big problem is -- more do do is needed, and if there was a way to syphone it off of this forum, we could fill up buckets, barrels and wheel borrows with inshore species, like they do in Lost Banana!
Texas also got lots of do do from all them bulls they raises o'er there and even more from their BS about ever thang being bigger o'er 'air!
In a land called, Perfect, sea grits grows on the beach dunes in patches next to those of sea oats!
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dstockwell
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- Joined: March 5th, 2002, 8:00 pm
- Location: Valdosta, GA
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nautigator
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