The Redfish Nation in cooperation with Coastal Kayak Angler will be adding two man kayak teams to the 2007 fishing circuit. Go to the following link to see the article. Redfish Nation
When more details become available I will post them. Much to my chagrin the fish will be brought in alive and relesed. CKA has developed a way to pierce the Redfish mouth with a type of stringer in such away that it can stay alive while in the water behind a kayak. When I hear more I will let you know. I met Phil last weekend at he TKAA tournament in Virginia and they are very excited about the partnership with redfish nation for 2007.
Redfish Nation welcomes Kayak Anglers in 2007
Moderators: bman, Chalk, Tom Keels
Re: Redfish Nation welcomes Kayak Anglers in 2007
Sounds like Shark bait to me.jsuber wrote:CKA has developed a way to pierce the Redfish mouth with a type of stringer in such away that it can stay alive while in the water behind a kayak.
Even when I used to wade fish I could only leave a fish on my stringer for about 10 minutes before I had to head back to the hill. If not, I would pull up my stringer and have only heads on it.
If we were all crazy, Wouldn't that make us all normal.
Believe me, this ain't something I agree with. But from what I have heard from those in the know, its more dramatic for the spectator to see a live fish, than a picture of one. Most kayak angler tournaments are done with cameras, but they want to make this a live fish tourney, and if thats what I have to do, I guess I'll have to think about it. I frankly don't know why we can't continue to photograph them, and since its a two man team tourney, we could take one photo on the measuring system, and another holding him up in the air like we would at the weigh in then release the fish back to its habitat. Then they could show it on what ever type of big screen they use at these things. But, thats just my opinion, and from what I understand, my opinion has been expressed quite a bit, butI'm not aboslutely sure of that either. We'll wait and see.
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RonHarrison
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I say we all get Apalach to start working on designs for a pull-behind, free-flowing livewell. We'll cash in BIG TIME!!!
Ron Harrison
Tallahassee, Florida
2006 Hobie Outback Rigging Photo Album @ http://www.nettally.com/rharri/riggingredirect.htm .
Tallahassee, Florida
2006 Hobie Outback Rigging Photo Album @ http://www.nettally.com/rharri/riggingredirect.htm .
Heres the problem. A lot of these saltwater tournaments copied the format of BASS tournaments and have made them successful. They bring in fish, weigh them and show them to the crowd. If kayaks are going to ride the coat-tails of these tournaments, they are going to have to follow the same format, even though they have no livewell, and no motor. If kayakers use the format that Extreme Edge developed which is photographs with an approved ruler and token, and then use another glory photo with the fish in the air, it could overshadow the big boy tournaments. Imagine that the big boys bring in a 7 lb redfish that is under the 27" maximum length (Depending on the state its in). They depend on whose luckiest and caught the fatest fish thats under the limit. Now the kayakers come in with pictures of their fish they catch and they appear on the big screen showing kayakers catching and releasing 20lb redfish. The big boys get $75000 in prizes and the kayakers win a free $1200 kayak. It would look pretty bad for the big boys to have the smaller fish with bigger prizes and kayakers with big fish and smaller prizes. Sponsors would most likely pull out of a tournament. Until the big boys switch to a more fish friendly format, which would hurt the "Keep fish alive products market" like livewell manufactureres and rejuvinate makers, the kayakers will most likely have to bring fish back alive too. I don't see it working real well in hot weather and shallow water, because the fish would die being dragged behind the boat or in a floating livewell. Maybe one day they will all switch to a photo and release tournament. I guess its hard to trust the photos when you have some tournament fisherman that ruin it for the rest by staking out fish ,or putting them in traps and recovering them on tournament day. Even the Bass tournaments have the Pros pair up with a random non-boat owner/rider when they fish the qualifing days, so there are some trust issues.
I think the solution is to photo and release, but thats probably a few years off.
I think the solution is to photo and release, but thats probably a few years off.
After reading the articles you linked, my interpretation is CKA approached Redfish Nation to develop this partnership. Redfish Nation agreed to the partnership, with some stipulations. The primary stipulation was the fish have to be brought to the scales. CKA came up with a way to do that.
Yes, most all tournament formats are structured similar to what BASS does. That's because it works. Any time there is money on the line, the placement will be determined at the scales. Bass, Redfish Nation, even, CKA, and every other tournament trail knows this.
The article indicates a separate series for the kayakers. The kayakers will not be competing in the same tournaments with the power boaters. This should make it easier to accommodate the kayakers. I suspect, if a kayak tournament is held from a single launch point, there will be a well prepared live release tank, provided by the sanctioning organization, to keep the fish alive until released.
There are literally millions of tournament anglers in this country, ranging from local clubs, all the way up to the pros. The overwhelming majority will be more than glad to tell you they want the results of a tournament to be determined at the scales. Most of the bigger tournaments do not reward participants for live releasing their fish, because live release is a requirement. They actually penalize the participants for dead fish.
You need to make a decision. Read the rules and requirements for a tournament. If you don't agree with the rules and requirements, don't participate.
I'll get off of my soap box now.
Yes, most all tournament formats are structured similar to what BASS does. That's because it works. Any time there is money on the line, the placement will be determined at the scales. Bass, Redfish Nation, even, CKA, and every other tournament trail knows this.
The article indicates a separate series for the kayakers. The kayakers will not be competing in the same tournaments with the power boaters. This should make it easier to accommodate the kayakers. I suspect, if a kayak tournament is held from a single launch point, there will be a well prepared live release tank, provided by the sanctioning organization, to keep the fish alive until released.
There are literally millions of tournament anglers in this country, ranging from local clubs, all the way up to the pros. The overwhelming majority will be more than glad to tell you they want the results of a tournament to be determined at the scales. Most of the bigger tournaments do not reward participants for live releasing their fish, because live release is a requirement. They actually penalize the participants for dead fish.
You need to make a decision. Read the rules and requirements for a tournament. If you don't agree with the rules and requirements, don't participate.
I'll get off of my soap box now.
What was I supposed to do today?
Thats fine and I like hearing everyones opinions, but EVERY kayak tournament I have fished in has been photo and release. I guess you would have to spend a little time in my seat to understand where I'm coming from and yes I have fished in my share of boat tournaments and I do know where they are coming from. Just because of millions of people do something does not mean its the best way to do it. if the goal is to catch and release a fish, then nothing is better than catching and releasing it where you caught it. If you dump them in the water an the spot closest to the tournament, half may be dead in a week from predators anyway. I can't see a downside to photo and release. Its actually a step up from catch and release.
Lets suppose you hold a photo and release tournament with 100 boats (any kind of boat) participating. Lets also suppose the tournament follows all State and Federal regulations for bag and slot. First place is $1000, second place is $500, right on down the line. Four boats bring in photos showing 27" fish. Who wins?
What was I supposed to do today?
The beauty is that they can photo bigger fish, AND release them. They have to measure them to see how big they are, photograph them then release. So bigger fish will be brought back via photograph.
Currently you recieve an approved measuring device, and a toke than has to be in each photo (Usually a sponsors emblem or logo).
Then the first photo si of the fisherman, second is the kayak (boat) at the launch site, then the third photograph is taken at daylight (Time when fishing is started) of your fish. You photograph and log all of your fish, then you circle the biggest fish on your log (Unless its a slam tournament then the biggest of each species), and turn in your digital or 35mm pictures. They develop the pictures of the winning fish, and hand out trophies at the ceremony.
Currently you recieve an approved measuring device, and a toke than has to be in each photo (Usually a sponsors emblem or logo).
Then the first photo si of the fisherman, second is the kayak (boat) at the launch site, then the third photograph is taken at daylight (Time when fishing is started) of your fish. You photograph and log all of your fish, then you circle the biggest fish on your log (Unless its a slam tournament then the biggest of each species), and turn in your digital or 35mm pictures. They develop the pictures of the winning fish, and hand out trophies at the ceremony.
Despite popular opinion, a healthy debate can be good. Sometimes you find out, that you didn't have all the facts. I can think of several reasons to make the change, but I can't think of any to keep it the way it is. The answer can't be "Thats the way it is". I bring this up here to hear other opinions and make informed decisions. The Redfish Nation has not set anything in stone yet, and I would like to understand everyones opinion on this subject. If I can make an informed presentation that can influence my position on the matter, the information and feedback I recieve here could be of great importance.
In Virginia they get citations (Good Ones) for catching a fish over a certain size. If you get a citation in each fish category you are considered a master angler (Often referred to as a paper chaser). Last week several people caught 58" Redfish and recieved a citation because it was over 46". you can't bring it in because the size limit is 28". They just record the length and release the fish. http://www.mrc.state.va.us/vswft/index.shtm
The citations are used to form statistical data on the numbers of fish in the area and carry weight in deciding limits on fish for the upcoming years. The limits help keep the fish in greater abundance so that future generations can enjoy catching the fish too.
My point is that you can catch oversized fish, record their size and win tournaments. Those manfacturers that have great investments in keeping fish alive for catch and release tournaments would be augmented by businesses that develop equipment for photo and release tournaments.
The fisherman still gets to catch fish, and has a photograph to show their grandchildren one day. The fish gets released back into its natural habitat, and will spawn more fish for those grandchildren to catch just like their grandparent did.
Now if you want ot make a little bit of money and everything is going to go to catch and release for kayaks too, then come up with a great way to keep fish alive while out in a kayak. I thought of a small kayak looking device that picks up water and tracks well behind the yak, and can keep a 28" redfish (Texas) alive.
In Virginia they get citations (Good Ones) for catching a fish over a certain size. If you get a citation in each fish category you are considered a master angler (Often referred to as a paper chaser). Last week several people caught 58" Redfish and recieved a citation because it was over 46". you can't bring it in because the size limit is 28". They just record the length and release the fish. http://www.mrc.state.va.us/vswft/index.shtm
The citations are used to form statistical data on the numbers of fish in the area and carry weight in deciding limits on fish for the upcoming years. The limits help keep the fish in greater abundance so that future generations can enjoy catching the fish too.
My point is that you can catch oversized fish, record their size and win tournaments. Those manfacturers that have great investments in keeping fish alive for catch and release tournaments would be augmented by businesses that develop equipment for photo and release tournaments.
The fisherman still gets to catch fish, and has a photograph to show their grandchildren one day. The fish gets released back into its natural habitat, and will spawn more fish for those grandchildren to catch just like their grandparent did.
Now if you want ot make a little bit of money and everything is going to go to catch and release for kayaks too, then come up with a great way to keep fish alive while out in a kayak. I thought of a small kayak looking device that picks up water and tracks well behind the yak, and can keep a 28" redfish (Texas) alive.
For redfish I can see the value in using length as the measuring stick. But, it is a different challenge to find the biggest slot red. A really skilled red hunter, like Nole 
, may be capable of boating 20-30 reds to find the one he wants to keep (not that Nole tourney fishes). This is a totally different challenge than someone lucking into one really long red (for instance by anchoring and throwing cut mullet into holes like Birddog and Chalk 
). So different rules, different challenges. I think with a kayak fisherman, the length rule make sense as they won't be as capable of covering the ground a flats boat will to find enough schools to boat the largest, heaviest 26er on the flats!
Like TC said, different strokes for different folks . Diversity in Red Tourney rules - what is this country coming too!.
, may be capable of boating 20-30 reds to find the one he wants to keep (not that Nole tourney fishes). This is a totally different challenge than someone lucking into one really long red (for instance by anchoring and throwing cut mullet into holes like Birddog and Chalk ). So different rules, different challenges. I think with a kayak fisherman, the length rule make sense as they won't be as capable of covering the ground a flats boat will to find enough schools to boat the largest, heaviest 26er on the flats!Like TC said, different strokes for different folks . Diversity in Red Tourney rules - what is this country coming too!.
We all find fish whether we fish in a yak or a boat, we just have to fish our limitations, much like a fisherman in a flats boat would not try to go out on two to three foot seas, whereas a guy in a bay boat might give it a shot. A guy in a yak will launch as close to a good spot qas possible then paddle on over and try and cover the area. The real problem exist in keeping a fish alive on the paddle back. One other solution might be using those tubes like Tuna fisherman use, but put reds in them rather than Tuna baits. At issue is "How would you keep the fish alive?" My focus is to alleviate that problem altogether by measuring fish and using the format that exising kayak tournaments currently successfully employ. There are kayak tournaments that weigh fish in Texas, but i don't think they keep them alive, and some do keep them alive, but with summer water temps I don't see it as be very feasible. Why push a horse to water, when you can ride him there?
